56. From From VA to 6-Figure OBM: A Simple Growth Path for Online Service Providers I Sarah Noked

In this episode of Soulpreneur Scaling Stories, I’m joined by Sarah Noked, founder of OBM School and a pioneer in the online business management space. Sarah shares her journey from starting as a virtual assistant to building a thriving agency and training a new generation of OBMs. We dive deep into what it means to be an online business manager, why OBM skills are essential for scaling, and how they help entrepreneurs move out of the daily grind and into visionary roles.

Sarah also opens up about the pivotal moments in her career, including the challenges of hiring her first employees and transitioning to a business model that allows for more freedom and flexibility. We explore the importance of systems, SOPs, and resourcefulness in running a successful business. Whether you’re a solopreneur or a seasoned service provider, this episode offers invaluable insights into scaling sustainably and intentionally.

If you’re ready to explore the world of online business management, or simply looking for ways to streamline your business operations, this conversation will leave you inspired and empowered.

Key Points Covered:
✨ What it means to be an OBM and why it’s vital for business growth
✨ The power of systems and SOPs in creating scalable operations
✨ How to transition from solopreneur to agency owner without burnout

Connect with Sarah:
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All the links
Accelerator Self Study
OBM Accreditation 

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Transcript

[00:00:00] Andrea Elibero: Andrea here, your host and passionate business coach and scaling strategist for Soulful Service Providers and Coaches. Welcome to another episode of Soulpreneur Scaling Stories. Have you ever wanted to look behind the curtain of your fellow entrepreneur's business to see what actually went into scaling it?

[00:00:22] Well, you are in for a treat because that's exactly what we are doing here. In each episode, we will be uncovering the truth behind the lessons and the stories behind what it truly takes for sole preneurs to scale their businesses intentionally. I'm hoping that their stories will help you to unlock the true potential of your business so you can create your own soulful, abundant and aligned laptop lifestyle through intentional scaling.

[00:00:46] So whether you're just starting out on your scaling journey or you're a seasoned entrepreneur seeking inspiration, this episode has something incredible in store for you. Are you ready to rise, grow and create? Create a business that fully supports your dream life. Well, let's [00:01:00] dive in before we begin.

[00:01:02] Make sure to hit that subscribe buttons. You never miss an empowering episode filled with real stories and soulful insights.

[00:01:11] Hello, everybody, and welcome back to another episode of Solpreneur Scaling Stories. I'm super excited to have Sarah Nogat here with me

[00:01:19] because we have a special relationship. Hey, Sarah, how are you?

[00:01:22] Sarah Noked: I'm fantastic. I'm really excited to be here.

[00:01:25] Andrea Elibero: Yeah. Okay. Well, why don't you go ahead and introduce yourself and tell everybody what it is that you do in your business today?

[00:01:31] Sarah Noked: Absolutely. So I actually started off as a solopreneur back in 2009. And you know, my real intention for starting online business as an online support professional at the time, I probably would have called myself a VA, although I was a yes woman. And I later learned more about and I think business changed online.

[00:01:50] And I later became an online business manager. And as I continued to Be a solopreneur. I eventually had children and then I [00:02:00] was like this solopreneur thing Ain't working for me anymore. I need to bring on some team I need to have some balance and that sort of led me to scale a really awesome agency that I have Literally brought I think through like 10 iterations that is still in existence today going on More than a decade strong as well as obm school where we train online business managers.

[00:02:24] So I started training obms also, I would say back in 2014 2018 when I started to kind of scale my agency and I realized that, wow, there's so much potential in the online space when you are doing done for you services. Um, and so I've had a really awesome experience. I've been in this field for more than a decade.

[00:02:45] Um, and I'm really happy to be here cause I think there's nothing more fun than inspiring people to kind of go out of the Andrea like us.

[00:02:54] Andrea Elibero: Oh, yeah. Yeah, but this is why we are here is to inspire people to go out of the norm. [00:03:00] Yeah, and so We know each other because you were actually my trainer my OBM trainer back in 2020 so it has been a minute yeah, it has been a minute and Even for me so me going through so many iterations of my own business all the time The thing that's interesting with being an OBM is that, and I think the thing that's really useful about it, is that I know how to run a business, like period, right?

[00:03:28] So like, no matter what I do, even though now this is not my necessarily, it's not my focus, even though I still do some OBM things, but it's not my focus focus. My business runs so smooth, right? Because I have these skills. So for those that don't know, maybe let's talk about what is an online business manager?

[00:03:44] Oh, do I make your heart happy by saying

[00:03:46] Sarah Noked: I did. That made me really happy because I always tell people who will listen that done for you services, whether you're an online business manager or a VA, a virtual assistant, and we'll talk more about those definitions. [00:04:00] I feel like done for you never, never, never, Goes out of style, everyone's willing to pay that.

[00:04:04] So it's a really good way to get like a shoe in to, um, like Andrea was saying, understanding how to run an online business, becoming more proficient in what that looks like and what really sort of captivated me. And I think this is very similar to what you were saying is like, I got to see all the back ends of these really cool businesses.

[00:04:27] And even though I'm very much a behind the scenes, like. Introverted, extroverted, whatever you want to call it, like, doesn't want to talk to people kind of person, leave me alone. Um, I really was inspired by the clients I was working with and I was like, if they can do it, I can do it. And even though I started off as an OBM and more as a done for you service provider, eventually I got into multiple streams of revenue and I had courses and I still have courses and communities and all kinds of different offers that my God, I [00:05:00] would have never, I mean, I had never planned for any of this stuff.

[00:05:03] So, um, yeah. So just to sort of define what an online business manager is. So an OBM is somebody who manages businesses, both offline businesses and online businesses, and we will really help. our clients by managing the parts and pieces of their business that essentially give them back more time. And I think that this was the thing that is becoming very much more of a thing these days in the online space is online businesses are booming.

[00:05:33] I mean, we, we saw during the pandemic, we continue to see it, we will continue to see it. And back in the day, you know, you needed a tech VA to sort of, you know, figure out how to like mush it all together. And now it seems to me that there's this level of managerial support that these people really need so that they get out of the driver's seat and they focus more on the things that only they can do in their business.

[00:05:57] It might be things like writing a book or creating [00:06:00] a course or, you know, doing sales calls or, or building affiliate relationships. I know that our clients in the agency need more time back and the only way they're going to get more time back is by having somebody who's a little bit more, um, accountable, responsible, who understands the big picture vision, who understands what the goals are in the business.

[00:06:21] And so, um, as an online business manager, And even inside of OBM school, like, we spend a lot of time, um, working on resources and frameworks around how we can support online and offline businesses at this level. Because, you know, if there's one thing the pandemic showed us, it's like, you need to have some semblance of online, Something or other, whether, you know, whether you have to pivot your events to online, whether you need, you know, account appointment booking online.

[00:06:49] So I think there's just a lot of fun things happening with online entrepreneurship that is so much better than the mundane nine to five, [00:07:00] my opinion. Mm

[00:07:02] Andrea Elibero: I mean, right, all of this is better than the Monday 9 to 5, even with all of the ups and downs. The other thing I will add to that is that one might think, and somebody who might hire an OBM is somebody generally in the six, seven figure range. So they have a business, right, that needs. more than just VA support.

[00:07:22] Like they're more than just, Oh, like, I'll tell you what to do when you do it type of a situation, right? They need more of a partner to actually make the business run. And the thing to me that's so crazy, is that a lot of these businesses, before they have an OBM come in, are really on fire, like all of the time.

[00:07:42] And I wasn't necessarily expecting that

[00:07:44] Sarah Noked: fire. Wow. Andrea, that's such a nice, like a dumpster fire. What kind of fire are we talking about? You

[00:07:51] Andrea Elibero: mean, it ranges, right? But like,

[00:07:53] Sarah Noked: I know. Yeah. And, and, you know, it's sort of like, it's a beautiful thing, right? Because [00:08:00] anyone, Kit can start an online business, right? But not everybody is going to be successful. And I and I always we was lovingly refer to our clients as successful despite themselves because they've somehow in their own way managed to get their business from 0 in revenue to 100 K or more in revenue, but they likely have No systems.

[00:08:21] Maybe they have a team. Maybe that team knows or doesn't know what they need to do. Their tech stack might be a little bit discombobulated. They might be still paying for tech they don't use anymore. So yes, these clients, um, are a little bit of a hot mess on the back end. But if you're like somebody who resonates with being organized and likes cleaning up things like Many of us do and are very research oriented and, you know, whether mindset, mindset, you know, you might think you can, but there's a YouTube tutorial out there for everything.

[00:08:53] Um, and I just think that it's, you know, for that kind of personality that likes cleaning up things, it is like [00:09:00] paradise because you're like, Oh, I see the standard operating procedures. Oh, I see all of the things that can be implemented, you know, project management tool. Amazing. Um, yeah, it's, it's, it can, it can be bananas though.

[00:09:14] Andrea Elibero: it really, it's really fascinating, honestly, to be like, wow, how did you get this far without any of this in place? Like, I find it so weird, especially as somebody who. Right? But like, as a person who is, like, naturally, like, thinks about systems, and like, when I do something in my business, like, I do the system right away.

[00:09:33] And that's just me naturally. I'm like, how? Like, to me, it's like, mind boggling to be like, how did you get this far without having any

[00:09:39] Sarah Noked: And how do you sleep at night?

[00:09:41] Andrea Elibero: that's a topic. Right?

[00:09:43] Sarah Noked: Like without a project management tool.

[00:09:46] Andrea Elibero: Right. I'm like, I'll ask my VA's like, please put this in ClickUp, right? Like, you know, if I, if I'm not in there, be like, please put this in there.

[00:09:53] I'm like, please,

[00:09:55] Sarah Noked: Or get those

[00:09:55] Andrea Elibero: like it doesn't exist. If it's not in ClickUp, it doesn't exist.

[00:09:58] Sarah Noked: Amen. I'm [00:10:00] so with you on that. I love that. Mm

[00:10:03] Andrea Elibero: Okay, so let's back up a second because I want to get into your story. Cause I love that digging in like as somebody who has done all of the things. So can you take us, and I don't, we don't need to go back through all the things.

[00:10:16] many years of you

[00:10:18] Sarah Noked: I know many decades of fun.

[00:10:20] Andrea Elibero: right? But in terms of, let's say your really fundamental pivots. So like the things that were really big and the big decisions you had to make in your business, if you look back, what was kind of your first like growth spurt, I want to say for some reason, and what did that look like?

[00:10:39] And take us behind the scenes of what was going on

[00:10:42] Sarah Noked: Yeah. And unfiltered. So, wow. So I would say that my first, um, big thing would have been hiring employees. So back when I was scaling my agency, it was about 2014. So I started in 2009, 10, 11, [00:11:00] 12, 13. So it was like five years into being online support professional. And let me put this out there because I, Unfortunately, I stayed straddling my corporate job and being a solopreneur for three years.

[00:11:13] Okay, so maybe that was my first big mistake was kind of being and you know, I mean, it was 2009. I just don't think people were doing it. And so I was like, there wasn't a lot of research like I was literally said, I'm sure people still sit there and write how to legitimately make. Money online except they're doing it in chat GPT instead of Google or chat search GPT search now so at any rate, um, I think my first big sort of pivot or Something or other that was very different from what I was doing was when I was like, you know what?

[00:11:45] I have an opportunity here to bring on employees I'm just going to hire all of these inexperienced but smart individuals to help me in my agency. And I think that was the first big [00:12:00] thing that I did because hiring employees really freaked me out. It was a lot of pressure. But it really It really taught me a lot about how to run an agency and how to attract the masses and scale it.

[00:12:15] Um, I think the problem for me was that, and also it taught me a lot about letting go. Cause, I mean, I love the name of your program. Of your podcast because it really resonates with me. 'cause I loved being a solopreneur. Like I, it's so ironic because I never imagined myself having a team. I'm like, I can do everything.

[00:12:33] I don't need anybody. So bringing on employees was like, oh my God, this is crazy. I had four employees, five including myself, and I literally train these beauties. I ran my agency for. Um, you know, it was like a good two, three years in that model. And then I had my second child and unfortunately, I had a team member, my lead team member, um, to say, you know what, I'm going back to [00:13:00] work.

[00:13:00] I want to put clothes and makeup on and go into a nine to five. And I was like, Oh my God, who are you? And so she sort of like really changed my business. And at that point I was like, you know what, I have a baby now. I'm just going to like. Sort of like. Liquidate my agency. I'm sure there's a nicer way to say that.

[00:13:21] But I was like, let's take all the assets and all the clients. I've already trained my and basically certified all of my O. B. M. S. Because we were running an agency like that, Um, and they just took. I just sort of pieced off the clients, and I was like, Hey, let's just sort of sim slow simmer for a while, and then we'll start up again.

[00:13:40] And at that same time, I started getting into products. So that was the other thing for me, I think, realizing from a businesses that I could create products that was like the next sort of big thing for me was marketing and Facebook ads and. Kind of venturing into that space and being like, Oh, my God, I actually really love [00:14:00] this.

[00:14:00] And it doesn't, you know, feel gross. And it feels very aligned, because I know that I'm selling something useful. And actually, the first product I sold was something for a person that would have hired an OBM. So you can't afford to afford to hire an OBM here, let me give you some of my systems templates, let me show you how to set up your virtual office, and so on and so forth.

[00:14:22] I started to get into training online business managers. So I, you know, I had some mentors and some relationships and I approached somebody in my life and I was like, let me take this over. Let me improve this. And that carried me on for another few years. And then like all good things that come to an end.

[00:14:45] Um, I found that that chapter in my life ended and I had this amazing opportunity to start OBM school and you know, OBM school is wonderful and I don't mean to like, you know, toot my own horn, but you know, I never, I never, I'm not a [00:15:00] visionary person. I never set out to be like, I'm going to create this school and I'm going to impact all of these people and train all these people.

[00:15:06] But you know, I, sometimes we're not always in control of that journey and I think that's what's important. And that's what I want to share here is that when you start as a solopreneur and you, and the onus is on you and you know, you're really giving it to yourself and you set your wings and you, you fly free, life will take you in places you cannot anticipate.

[00:15:30] And it is so much more exciting than the mundane, boring day to day. of most, you know, I hate to say it, but I have, I have a really an exciting life. I think back on some of the clients I've worked with and the people that I've been able to train and I feel very fulfilled in my life. And had I subscribed to the regular, whatever, or, you know, didn't have that supportive push from my partner and family.

[00:15:58] I don't know. I don't know. [00:16:00] Maybe I'd be working at a bank. I don't know.

[00:16:03] Andrea Elibero: Something that you said really hit me and I thought was so cool is that basically you start, right, you just like start and just be open to see what happens and what unfolds because it sounds like um, Well, one, it sounds like you kind of made a lot of things happen, like you took initiative on a number of things and But also you saw things, right?

[00:16:26] So you saw like, oh, like that's kind of cool. Like, let me try that. Oh, that's kind of cool. Like, oh, this could be a good opportunity. Like, let me try that. So there was a lot of in depth innovation or there was a lot of, ooh, like, that sounds kind of interesting. So is this who you are naturally? Where did this drive come from to be like, oh, let me experiment in this place.

[00:16:44] And for somebody who maybe has those thoughts and say, oh, I want to do this, but, and then the buts and the doubts and all of that takes over, what would you say to that person?

[00:16:53] Sarah Noked: So, okay, so I want to start with the buts and the doubts because I, I seriously, in my mind, I [00:17:00] know exactly where I was sitting at the time. I was still in my corporate job. I had just moved to the Middle East from Canada with my husband in a completely new place. I don't speak the language.

[00:17:11] I have this like crappy nine to five corporate job that I really don't like, but it pays the bills. And I'm like crying to him in this cafe, like I'm never going to be able to make this work. So there were a lot of buts. Like I'm not, I don't want to take away and make it seem like I was certain. Like I had a lot of buts.

[00:17:31] I had a lot of these moments where I really didn't think I could work. And I remember my, my partner, my husband saying to me at that point in life, being like, He was talking to me in shekels, which is the currency where we live, but he's like, oh, you just need to make like 2000 or 1000 bucks a month.

[00:17:47] We'll be okay. I was like, say what? I'm like, no. So I needed a challenge. I was like, I'm going to crush that goal. So that was, I think what sort of like ignited me. I was like, don't you under, I [00:18:00] mean, he was doing it in a very loving way, but I was like, don't you dare underestimate me. Um, and the thing that I've realized in retrospect is that I am a.

[00:18:09] A very, very resourceful person. And I was speaking to somebody yesterday about the same topic about being resourceful. I think that is my greatest quality is that I can look at a problem and not always see a problem. I'm like, okay, yeah, that's a problem. But now I'm going to go and find like this other solution that I would have that's completely out of the box.

[00:18:31] So, you know, obviously moving to the Middle East was a, was a big problem. I don't, I didn't speak the language. I'm like, this is not, but it, it, and I say this to you also, because I think it's really important to be honest. If I wasn't, if I didn't have to move overseas, I don't know if I would have picked this line of work.

[00:18:49] You know, I think, Being in a new country, and I know you can relate to this, although you had established yourself beforehand, um, I was like, I'm in a new place, I don't know anybody, like, I [00:19:00] have to, and also, I knew that I always wanted to be a mom, and now here I go off on another tangent, but being a mom and having, like, Uh, the giving my my kids the experience of a stay home mom, which is so gnarly in today's day and age, but that's actually what I wanted.

[00:19:17] I wanted to give my kids this experience. And so I knew that. I needed to have flexibility and I knew that I need, I had like a sort of like a wish list. I was like, now I need to get resourceful. So, um, you know, eventually I kind of made my way. And even when I look back, some of my first clients were so pivotal, such pivotal experiences for me because I felt like I was making magic happen.

[00:19:42] So I just want to share this story with you because I think that. I mean, I'm not a very, I am sometimes woo woo and sometimes I'm not, I know you're a little bit more woo than I am, but I do believe that stars line, align, and I do believe in manifestation and fate and certain [00:20:00] things lining up in certain ways, like I'm very woo woo with regard to that, and so my first client Was somebody that I had been in an online program with because of course I was trying to exhaust all my resources and get resourceful and creative.

[00:20:14] So I joined B School, which is still alive and well today, but this was like 2000 and like, I don't know, six or seven. And there was this one woman in B School who was a storytelling coach. She's still in business today, very successful. And I knew she was in B School. I also knew that she lived in my neck of the woods.

[00:20:33] She was also an expat. And I was like, This is going to be my first client and I'm not even joking you, like within a month, um, my corporate company, which is like random, chose her to be a speaker at one of our events in Seville in Spain. And so when I got to Spain, I was like, now I'm going to be like, this was years ago, but I was like, I'm at a conference with my, my dream client.

[00:20:59] I know I want to [00:21:00] leave my corporate job. I was like, if the, if the signs aren't pointing to like, leave your job and do this, then I don't know how much clearer I need this smack in my face. So I just felt like there was a lot of signs from above, you know, and, um, and I felt safe also. So I was like looking for the signs, but I also felt safe.

[00:21:19] And I also knew that I was like, I was being very diligent in like thinking about what I wanted and what I wanted it to look like as well. Which was

[00:21:27] Andrea Elibero: And this is really important, right, too, is that it sounds like you did have a vision. You're like, okay, this is what I want. And that clarity to me, and this is what I, I'll back up to that in a second, but that clarity in knowing like, oh, this is my vision. This is what I want. That helps so much in figuring out the align steps to take and actually make it happen.

[00:21:48] Right. Because in myself, in my journey, when I started as a VA, because I was like, I need to work for my laptop. I need freedom. I don't want to work in my, you know, job anymore. I had this, you know, I was in a [00:22:00] PhD program for clinical psychology for seven years. Like, I could be a life coach. No, I have no idea how to be a life coach.

[00:22:04] Like, I don't know how to do that. Like, how do you do, you know, how do you make a business online? No idea. Search the internet. Oh, I could be a virtual assistant. I could do that. Like, sure, you know, like, I could figure that out. And so I did. And then I accidentally got all these clients and accidentally created But it wasn't in my vision, right?

[00:22:21] Like I didn't know what I wanted. I let my business lead me at that point. And then I burned it down shortly after and then became an OBM and blah, blah, blah, all these things, right? So it's so important to, to have that vision as the first step. And even if you're not super clear, like start taking the steps and then it will come.

[00:22:37] Right? So I think that's like

[00:22:39] Sarah Noked: Yeah. I think too, and just further to what you're saying, like even with your VA agency and kind of like, quote unquote, burning it down, because I, I distinctly remember that when we met and you just being like, Hey, this needs to change. But I bet in retrospect, when you look back at that, your, that your experience of having those VA clients, you're like, Oh yeah, that needed to happen in order for this to [00:23:00] happen and in order for me to.

[00:23:02] So I think like also to. I find like a lot of the, cause I'm, I'm, I'm lucky enough to deal with entrepreneurs daily and I often ask them, you know, when you look back at your journey, can you see clear steps that led you to where you are? And they're like, Oh my God, my experience in HR, or I had this client and he was an accountant.

[00:23:22] And it's just so interesting to me because. Everybody's experience is so unique, and I think the, the thing is, is that a lot of people don't give it to themselves, or they feel like they can't, like, just like how you so lovingly said, like, I let my business guide me for a little bit. There's nothing wrong with that.

[00:23:40] I think you need to sort of have an ebb and flow and, you know, like I've had three kids during my OBM. And I had to, like, let certain things go and ebb and flow and, and, you know, I've had ups and downs and all around. And I still look back and I'm like, I wouldn't change a single thing.

[00:23:59] Andrea Elibero: Well, so [00:24:00] along those lines, you know, it's interesting in my case, especially like, particularly is that I think that because I'm coaching, I think I've had to go through all of these experiences, had all of these mistakes so I can help people to find, to not do all of the mistakes that I have made, right?

[00:24:16] To like kind of skip over some of those and, and speed it up a bit and do the things that are more aligned with them. So I feel like that was my path for a reason.

[00:24:25] Sarah Noked: Yes. That's makes a lot of sense.

[00:24:28] Andrea Elibero: anything.

[00:24:29] Sarah Noked: Yeah, that's true. Because you also get to really experience. So you mostly work with owners

[00:24:38] Andrea Elibero: So with service providers, yeah.

[00:24:40] Sarah Noked: service providers. That's right. Yes.

[00:24:41] Andrea Elibero: Service providers, mm hmm. So it's my people,

[00:24:45] Sarah Noked: yeah. Those are my people too. I love those

[00:24:47] Andrea Elibero: Yeah, I know. Yes. Because you know what's beautiful about service providers? That we're all so nice that we all just want to help,

[00:24:56] Sarah Noked: Yeah, we're heart of service

[00:24:57] Andrea Elibero: help you do this.

[00:24:58] [00:25:00] Yeah.

[00:25:00] Sarah Noked: Um, yeah, we always want to help. We always want to make things better sometime to our own dismay, I will say.

[00:25:09] Andrea Elibero: Right. Well, yeah, hence the, and I've been really focused lately and I'm doing all this research on burnout because I see so much burnout. And that's one of the things also that led me, yeah, to, to OBM and, and then beyond that was, was trying to figure out, okay, like I'm doing a lot, I'm juggling all of these clients, all of these things are going on, how do I make this better?

[00:25:32] And so if we return actually to the. OBM situation, because I feel like this would be really interesting. So for somebody who's like, Oh, maybe this could be my path. Can you talk about ways that you can have an OBM business and maybe have it be, because you could have the right, the one on one retainers, but there's a lot of other stuff that you can do as well when you're trained in this.

[00:25:54] So can you talk about some of these different paths that

[00:25:57] Sarah Noked: Yeah, absolutely. I think that it's, I, first [00:26:00] of all, I want to start by saying, cause I get this, ask this question all the time. Yes, you can have an OBM business on the side of a full time job, you know? So I would say that if you are working in a retainer type scenario where you retain a client month upon month, 20 hours a month, it's like an hour every night.

[00:26:20] So I just want to put that out there that everything is possible and, you know, you can absolutely. She like it's like a choose your own adventure kind of thing. And then yes, exactly Andrea. So further to what you're saying is So we have a lot of individuals who are not interested in working on retainer, meaning they don't want a long term client relationship, and I understand why, they prefer working project based.

[00:26:47] So, um, I'm very big on retainer. On projects, I'm very big on like dating projects as well. And you know, if you have, especially if you're coming from the VA space or any other service support professional, maybe you are, um, [00:27:00] proficient in bookkeeping or maybe you are proficient in being a tech VA, you can always do like some sort of audit as a project and you could come in here and there.

[00:27:09] There's also VIP days and a whole slew of other ways to work with clients on a project basis. Um, but I, I just think it's really important to think about your day and be able to like block the time out that you could dedicate because I will, contrary to many other types of online service support professionals, an online business manager needs to have their Take care.

[00:27:37] in order, right? We need to have a website. We need to have proper client funnels that you need to have like social media that is, you know, consistent on LinkedIn and Instagram and whatever else you're choosing to use because clients that want to hire an OBM, they do their due diligence. They want to make sure that you are who you say you are.

[00:27:57] Um, and, and all of this stuff, if they want to work with [00:28:00] you. So whether it's a project where it's a retainer, um, there's many, many different. Routes that somebody can take in the O. B. M. Space. There's different kinds of clients as well. Like so when you were when you were speaking, I was thinking to myself, you know, when I speak with O.

[00:28:15] B. M. S. Who are really just getting their business started. I always like to kind of help them figure out who their first client might be, because I feel like everyone thinks it's like this big old mystery, and it's so complicated and in my experience and it's really not. I don't have the statistics, but I would say that 75 percent of our students and our community find their first client literally under their nose.

[00:28:39] You know, so I think like what we're talking about, you know, just about positivity and putting out the word, it's really important for you to speak about what you're doing, to tell other people what you're doing, because I find the likelihood of a family member knowing an entrepreneur, or knowing an entrepreneur Or having a connection to some kind of entrepreneurial community, you know, is going to happen if you speak about it.

[00:28:58] So [00:29:00] and again, you might be doing just projects and inside, obviously inside of OBM school, there's a lot of different formulas and frameworks, and I'm not going to get into the whole, Shebang, but, um, we have a lot of different resources for different kinds of OBMs, those who want to stay solo OBMs, those who want to scale a team and those who want retainers, those who prefer to do project based work because maybe they have a chronic illness and they can't do day to day stuff.

[00:29:27] Also, big clients versus small clients. I mean, there's definitely something for everybody in the OBM space and especially in this crazy online world that we live in.

[00:29:39] Andrea Elibero: Can I, oh, I wanted to tell you before to share my first OBM client, because it's kind of a similar story to yours almost. And listen, so I am not. So for those of you out there, I am shyer, more introverted, especially more towards the beginning of my business. Now, you and this is also gives you hope if you also feel the same, like, Oh, I can't go out there.

[00:29:58] I can't be visible, etc. You [00:30:00] learn to do it,

[00:30:01] Sarah Noked: Yeah, you do. And I'm like

[00:30:02] Andrea Elibero: you gain the confidence.

[00:30:03] Sarah Noked: And like Andrea, I can vouch. It is true. Now I'm like, who cares? I'm gonna pop on here and do whatever. But God, I remember the first time you did a Facebook live pain, the agony.

[00:30:14] Andrea Elibero: yeah. So scared for so long and then and then I wouldn't show up without looking so amazing And now I'll record like reels with no makeup just getting out of it You know i'll pop up on my stories like I don't I don't care like so So you will grow it will get better. I promise you we two of both of us would tell you that But what I did, which was so out of character for me, is that there was somebody who is sort of famous, quote unquote, in like a spiritual community.

[00:30:40] And she was having a live, an in person event in Miami where I had lived at the time. And so I was like, Ooh, I get to meet this like famous person. Like, cool. And I'm like, you know what? I'm just going to ask her. Like, so it's not like, Oh, can I work with you? But I was like, Oh, like, like, I'm just curious.

[00:30:55] Like, this is what I do. How do you run, like, how do you run your business? She's like, oh no, you know, I don't have that much [00:31:00] help. I just, you know, whatever. And I was in her community and then she messaged me. Like, oh, I remember you. You had asked me about this. Like, let's chat about that. And this famous person was my first OBM client.

[00:31:11] Like, that's insane, right?

[00:31:13] Sarah Noked: Yeah. And like just, I mean, in Miami and having those stars aligned, stars aligned, crazy.

[00:31:20] Andrea Elibero: right? So, so like you were saying, they're right under your nose. If you talk about it, you know, your clients are under your nose as long as you're willing to get past those uncomfortable Doubts those are that uncomfortable feeling and being like I'm just gonna tell somebody what I do and say hey if you know anybody Like and then that's what happens and then it just goes from there

[00:31:42] Sarah Noked: Yeah. And I want to, I will also say that I think it's really important for people to know that they have transferable skills. Like as an online business manager, I mean, you don't, you don't need to have some fancy degree. You need to be an organized person. [00:32:00] Responsible human being, but you also need to be confident in that you have life skills, you know, like, yeah, I had a little bit of project management, a little bit of team management for my corporate job.

[00:32:12] I had like sales management from a job I had in high school, you know, like just, just like a lot of the more, like, I think basic jobs I had even as a kid have influenced my OBM style more than anything.

[00:32:28] Andrea Elibero: Yeah, and what's funny is that I didn't really have any of that experience. I was, so after I did psychology, I went into nursing, and so I was a nurse, and then I worked in clinical trials research, and in clinical trials research, you would have just like binders of all your client, you know, all of your patient's informations, and everything has to be, like, there's a lot of details in there.

[00:32:48] And so I'm the one who can be like, Oh, I need that. And I was like, Oh, yeah, it's marked with that purple post it note on page three, you know, I was just naturally very organized, but I did not have any of these skills before I started in the online space. [00:33:00] I knew nothing. So we can all learn and we can learn to

[00:33:03] Sarah Noked: We can all learn and that, that my friends, that growth mindset is where it's at and believing that you can, as an adult, learn new things, like, we can, we can do it all. I think, and again, just to kind of go back to my beginning of my story where I was talking about how I was being resourceful, I sometimes think that people, Choose a nine to five And choose kind of like work for the man quote unquote because it's easier than being an entrepreneur and it's easier than Doing these uncomfortable things that we're talking about today on the podcast where you have to you know talk about it and manifest it and think about it and And so, you know, I think moving across the border, like overseas from Canada, like I didn't have options.

[00:33:49] And I think that's, I have to be honest about that. I couldn't just go to a regular nine to five because I bet if I could, I probably would have. And I would have never had this like adventurous life where I literally [00:34:00] like, you know, we were in Spain, I was in Greece this month, I went on two vacations. I'm like, you know, and I and I have a wonderful team and an OBM on my team.

[00:34:11] So I feel like almost like I have like I have to pinch myself sometimes.

[00:34:15] Andrea Elibero: And it's funny about being resourceful. When you talk about being resourceful, I think, yes, I started my business in the US and then, but I did it so I could move abroad, like so I could move to where I ended up in Spain. And no,

[00:34:29] Sarah Noked: No, right?

[00:34:30] Andrea Elibero: no plan.

[00:34:31] Sarah Noked: There was no plan. Like, I

[00:34:32] Andrea Elibero: No,

[00:34:34] Sarah Noked: looks good on you. I bet you're like salsa dancing

[00:34:36] Andrea Elibero: and this is, this is why you have to be open to things.

[00:34:40] So, so I said, I want to work from my laptop, period. I have two giant dogs, right? Like they are my children and they are 12 and 13 right now. And. when I realized that I, so I have Italian, an Italian passport. I have Italian citizenship by bloodlines by [00:35:00] birth. I said, Oh, I can do this thing. Cool. So I'm going to get this passport because it'll open some sort of, I have no idea how I'm going to do anything.

[00:35:06] There was no plan. It took three years. So it took three years. I got my Italian passport in the summer of 2020 when I couldn't go anywhere. And, and right. I have a US based partner or are you at, you know, had a partner, like This is my boyfriend. We live in Miami. I said, I don't know, maybe I'll go back and forth.

[00:35:25] But I put all the pieces together so that way when the opportunity arose we could do it, you know, like, like Also, I also kind of like since we met I was like this is my plan and we'll figure out how it works And you know,

[00:35:38] Sarah Noked: yourself. This

[00:35:39] Andrea Elibero: I'm not gonna stay, right? Yeah

[00:35:41] Sarah Noked: Yes.

[00:35:42] Andrea Elibero: You know, just drop those those nuggets into his brain.

[00:35:44] So that way when

[00:35:46] Sarah Noked: Planting seeds. That's all it is, is

[00:35:48] Andrea Elibero: yes

[00:35:48] Sarah Noked: friends. Yes.

[00:35:51] Andrea Elibero: Yeah, so basically what happened was after pandemic like Miami, the rent in Miami tripled and I was like, well, there's nowhere in the other like there's nowhere else in [00:36:00] the US I'd want to live. And so it just kind of became a hey, like, this is a good time.

[00:36:04] Like we could do this. And Spain, Because we didn't have to get married to be here. So I could take him, I could import him, and he could be here as my partner, and it would be fine. Italy, we would have had to have been married, and it just, I kind of spoke, spoke some Spanish a bit beforehand, and it just all kind of,

[00:36:20] Sarah Noked: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You got the, you got the flavor, right?

[00:36:23] Andrea Elibero: Yeah, yes, yes. Yes, so so yeah, so but it just speaks to the fact that I this was my vision I didn't know the step by step plan, right? Like I didn't know how I was going to move abroad but I said I really want to have this experience and Put the pieces in place that I could and then when it was time it was time and I was able to do that So the other piece to that is that when you're talking about being resourceful, I'm not going to say there have never been times since I've been in Spain these past couple years where I've been like, uh, can I find a job?

[00:36:55] Is there a job? And just like had a moment of, of, and the [00:37:00] honest answer is not really. So I also feel like I don't have other options, but in a good way, right? Like I don't, I can't just go and be like, Oh, I can just drive Uber or like do DoorDash or something like that, because I wouldn't make any money and I would not be able to survive.

[00:37:15] So the options are more limited and people do not get paid as much, you know, here

[00:37:20] Sarah Noked: And so you're forced to get creative. Yes. And so it's like, I sometimes, that's why I always, and I'm sure you do the same thing, but I always tell my clients, I'm like, you really need a strong why. Because if your why ain't strong enough, you're definitely going back to some crappy job that is not going to be fulfilling in any way, shape or form.

[00:37:38] Um, and I, and I oftentimes find that I have to like work sometimes with people to kind of like really, I'm like, no, dig deeper. Dig deeper. It's in there somewhere. You know, it's not enough to want to make money. Like you need the freedom. You need the flexibility. Oh, you always need the financial. We got to put food on our table.

[00:37:55] We got to, you know, we have to eat and put a roof over our heads, but we [00:38:00] also, um, can't just have it be, Oh, I want to make money. That's why this, I need to have this business. So that financial is just, it's not enough. It's just one part of the equation. Um,

[00:38:11] Andrea Elibero: hmm. Yeah, totally. Because the money is the tool and that's not the thing that's going to, to drive anything. There was one point where, and I always say this, or when I was making the most amount of money was when I was the most miserable because I

[00:38:24] Sarah Noked: I know. So yeah, so the thing that, um, you know, broke the agency in the first iteration when it was even before my lead OBM kind of picked up and left, um, after I had my second child, but the other piece was like, we were, you know, we were making like a hundred K a month and I say that.

[00:38:44] Because, um, that's with five full time salaries, that's with expenses, so the profit was only about 15, 000 a month. It wasn't like a crazy, but I was making tons of money and I remember at one point saying to myself, Sarah, this is so good, I don't know [00:39:00] how you did it, but just keep doing what you're doing and don't change anything.

[00:39:05] And I look back and I was like, Oh my God, if, if Emily had never put in her resignation and d d d d d d d d d d My God, would I still be running that age? I've been miserable. It was like, I was, it was,

[00:39:18] it was a lot of work. Like I had five, there was five full time team members. Like we had like 20 plus clients on our roster.

[00:39:27] We were, I was constantly doing sales calls. I was working. I had clients in every area code we had from pacific time all the way to New Zealand every we had a client in every continent and I was like, I literally do not sleep and I was obviously it was a long time ago. I was much younger, but I was like, I could never do that again.

[00:39:48] So, yes, um, I kind of enjoy the ride and always be evolving and moving. Like there's no such thing as like stagnation. I just continue like that taught me to continue to look [00:40:00] forward that, you know, better things are coming and I shall continue to evolve as an entrepreneur, as a human being, as a

[00:40:06] Andrea Elibero: hmm. Yeah. Mm hmm.

[00:40:07] Sarah Noked: as everything.

[00:40:08] Andrea Elibero: Yeah. A thousand percent. And, and it also is nice, I think, for people to hear that you don't have to stay doing the thing that's making you miserable. You get to change it. Right. You get to innovate. You get to make choices. You get to say, Oh, I don't, I'm actually not happy. Even though I'm successful, quote unquote.

[00:40:26] Sarah Noked: right. Yeah. You might be making money, but if you're miserable or you have no, I'm gonna be talking about burnout and the work life balance. It's like what we were talking about before we hopped on the podcast. Burnout. That is the recipe for burnout because you know, the money is not enough. And I see this a lot.

[00:40:41] I see this a lot. Um, and I know we can both relate to this, but when I was a VA or offering more of like everything kind of services. Like you end up with tons of clients on your roster and you have all of these people contacting you there. You feel like you don't own yourself anymore. Um, so yeah, [00:41:00] so I'm very.

[00:41:01] Yeah, awful, but true. Um, and I just, uh, so I'm a really big advocate for like, less is more, you know, more money, less clients. better service, more, but again, it's not for everybody and not everybody wants to be an OBM. And you need to be honest with yourself. Is this something I want? Because we need VAs in this world.

[00:41:21] I have two incredible VAs on my team who implement and get things done and do the things that quote unquote, the OBMs don't want to do. And we just want to be in the big picture and manage things, but you need implementation. You need someone to QA and you need all the parts and pieces to really have a successful business.

[00:41:39] But I don't think that You have to give yourself also the opportunity to see what you like to put

[00:41:45] Andrea Elibero: Well, and you like different things, I think. At different times, you know, before I was happily implementing and then I was happy being like the OBM with my, like, set like one on one retainer clients long term, and now I'm more [00:42:00] like, no, I'd rather just do the strategy and like somebody else go do the thing, you know, like, like, because I kind of like higher level, higher level and things that I gravitate more towards this now and then I get to shift and evolve and etc, etc.

[00:42:11] So, yeah. Yes. Okay. One last question, because we've gone over, because we can chat about this forever, is your biggest scaling tip. So something that you've learned along your journey, something that you would love to share with everybody.

[00:42:25] Sarah Noked: Oh, wow. My biggest scaling tip. Be resourceful, I think. I think we've been talking about it a lot today. Be resourceful. Don't undervalue. Don't play or underestimate the power of manifesting and speaking about what you want. And also have really great desires in life. Like I think one of the most wonderful things that I really love to do and spend probably way too much time in my business doing is strategic planning.

[00:42:55] You know? So plan for your [00:43:00] growth and then release it into the universe because you don't need to be attached or fixed to anything. But I do really think it's about being resourceful and finding opportunity where someone might see a problem. I think that's been my, that's been my, my kind of MO. Um, I think people see problems all the time.

[00:43:21] They're like, I can't do that because of this. I'm like, Oh, I, I live in the Middle East and I can do this. Because I, I, I, I'm looking at this ass backwards, you know, like something crazy. So I think being resourceful and just kind of like having faith in yourself.

[00:43:38] Andrea Elibero: Beautiful, beautifully said. And let us know. Okay. Where can we find you? How can we stay in touch with you? If somebody wants to join OBM school, like, what are all the

[00:43:46] Sarah Noked: Yeah. So, um, uh, we'll definitely, I'm sure leave some, some, um, URLs in the show notes. Uh, we have an amazing, um, online business manager, manager starter kit that, uh, we've got for you [00:44:00] guys. You can find me at obmschool. com. You can find me, Sarah Noakhead, at pretty much, I mean, I'm not on Tik Tok, but Instagram and Facebook and yeah, don't be shy, reach out and tell me your solopreneur story.

[00:44:15] Andrea Elibero: Awesome. Amazing. Thank you so much, Sarah, for being here. 

[00:44:19] Thank you so much for joining us today. I really hope you found inspiration and insights from today's episode. You know, scaling your business intentionally and from the inside out is a transformational process, but I'm here to support you every step of the way. Head on over to dancingleafsolutions. com slash resources for free tools to help you do just that.

[00:44:44] And thank you again for being a part of the Soulpreneur Scaling Stories community, your presence and dedication to growth, inspiring me every day.